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Michael C Anthony

Stage Fright?

Michael shares riveting stories about how he moved past fear and imposter syndrome to become the preeminent expert in stage hypnosis.

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Find Michael's superior stage hypnosis training at https://stagehypnosisuniversity.com/

Learn more about booking Michael for a show at https://michaelcanthony.com/

Find Michael's body language book at https://amzn.to/3iD0KIf

 

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0 (0s):
If you were haunted and harassed by your own inner critic, if you've ever been curious about why hypnosis works so well, if you're a seasoned hypnotist, or if you suspect that the inner critic is actually hypnotizing you to hold back from reaching the greatness that you know, deep down is inside you, lean in and get inspired to get out of your comfort zone and create your one precious life with purpose and intention. If you like this show, you'll love my powerful hypnosis audio, the answer room, because it gives you crystal clear guidance and direction and illuminates an ingenious way to make triumphant decisions.

0 (47s):
No matter how stuck you feel or how confused you were. This powerful hypnosis audio is my gift to you. When you go to the imposter monster.com again, that's the imposter monster.com. Don't forget the, the, the imposter monster.com. And yes, I'm done saying it. Thank you. Thank you. From the bottom of my heart for listening. I'm Lori Hammond, and I'm truly grateful for you.

1 (1m 18s):
I'm the kind of person who, when I'm choosing a movie to watch, I will watch a little bit of the trailer. And as soon as I realize I want to watch it, I turn off the trailer because I want to know as little about the movie as possible. I want to be surprised. And I felt similarly when interviewing this week's podcast guests, I already knew that Michael C. Anthony is one of the top stage hypnotists in the world. And two of the men who I respect and admire the most in this world, my command Dell and Chris Thompson consider him to be an absolutely amazing person, hypnotist and stage hypnotist. So I was so excited to interview him.

1 (2m 1s):
And after the interview, I started looking at all of his accolades and I was really glad that I didn't look ahead of time, because I think I would have been intimidated to have this conversation with him. I want you to know that VH1 calls Michael, the best stage hypnotists on the planet he's been seen on CBS, ABC, NBC, and Fox. And he is also the hypnotist in the world. Famous touring show, the illusionist, which is the highest grossing film of its kind in the world. He is an Amazon best-selling author and a popular corporate speaker. His book, body language secrets, how to read minds by reading bodies is considered the only body language book you'll ever need to read in the corporate world.

1 (2m 51s):
Michael trained sales professionals with his keynote shut up and sell with your body. The thing that appealed to me the most is he has stage hypnosis university, where he teaches people to go from absolute beginner to expert in the field of stage hypnosis. I don't necessarily anticipate becoming a stage hypnotist, but I think it would be fun to learn. And I realized that there's so much value in understanding stage hypnosis that will apply to my career as a therapeutic hypnotist, both in one-on-one work and in the group work that I do. So I invite you to watch this and just enjoy this conversation.

1 (3m 33s):
Michael shares some awesome stories that will have you engaged and have you leaning in as he talks about how he has gone from absolute beginner to expert in his field and understand that if Michael can do it. So can you enjoy this conversation, Michael, thank you so much for being here today. I am absolutely honored to have you on the show. Our mutual friends, Mike Mandel, and Chris Thompson speaks so highly of you and Chris recommended that I have you as a guest on the show. He said, you'll have some tremendous stories for us. So thank you for being here.

2 (4m 10s):
Great to be here, Lori. Thanks for having me.

1 (4m 13s):
I think a lot of the people listening to the show are probably familiar with you, but for someone who is tuning in and doesn't, isn't familiar with your work, will you just tell us a little bit about who you are and what you do?

2 (4m 24s):
Sure. My name is Michael C. Anthony, and I'm a stage hypnotist. I'm an entertainer I'm qualified to do hypnotherapy, but I've spent the last 26 years of my life touring around the world, using hypnosis for fun and entertainment. One of those guys that gets a whole bunch of people on stage makes him do funny things. Thank you. Good night. That's my job.

1 (4m 49s):
You tell me a little bit. Chris told me that you might have a great story to tell us about your first ever show and how, how that went down.

2 (4m 58s):
Find out how crazy I am. So here's what, here's what I did. I was this, the strange thing is my great uncle. Joel mnemonic was his name was the stage hypnotist, but I never saw him perform. He was a magician. Did lots of, you know, pulled coins out of my mind, my brother's ears. And I coincidentally not through him. Cause he was, you know, one of these great uncles, you see him every five years, maybe. Right? And I coincidentally got into slight of hand magic close-up magic card tricks, coin tricks, all that stuff. Mentalism. And so that was a hobby of mine. I did not like my nine to five.

2 (5m 38s):
I worked for general motors, nothing wrong with that, but I just didn't want to do. I just felt like I would like to get out of that situation and do something on my own. I'm more entrepreneurial minded. So I bought a cookie store up in Canada when I lived there. This is why my connection to Mike and Chris I'm from Canada originally, even though I'm in Florida, now we're taught. So I'm running this cookie store and I'm doing magic tricks for sure. People that come up and you know, so it's a lot of fun. I'm actually making money with it. Right? Well, a guy comes up to me one day who worked in the mall and he says, Hey, I see there's saw an ad in the paper.

2 (6m 21s):
There's a stage hypnotist. You want to go see it? And I said, yeah, that's what my uncle does. Right. But I've never seen it. I'm interested in going to see it. So we go see the show, lo and behold, it's Mike Mendell. I never met him. Right. This is, this is going back to 1992. Right? And so I'm watching the show from an entertained entertainers viewpoint because I, you know, I didn't magic and all that kind of stuff. And I'm watching him. And as you know, Mike is brilliant the way he uses language, the way he uses hypnosis, I'm watching him.

2 (7m 1s):
And I think to myself within 20 minutes, I say to myself, this is what I want to do with my life. Right. And, but how right? How there's no internet, there's nowhere to learn anything. The best you can get on learning hypnosis in those days was like a little pamphlets and things like that. Right? So I'm studying everything. I can get my hands on and I'm going to see other stage hypnotists and you know, trying to, why does this guy do this? Why does this guy do it like this? Why is this guy do it like this? And I'm trying to make sense of it. I'm essentially building a matrix on what, putting these things together and seeing what I can, if I can create anything anyway.

2 (7m 44s):
So I've got to show on paper and, but it's a far off dream. I quit for two and a half years. I'm like, who do you think you are? You can't do this stuff. Right? What are the chances? Right. Just do what you're doing and remain that way. Somehow one day, I don't know why Laurie. I remember I was sitting in a rocking chair and listening to music and instantly some of that comes up and he says something in my head goes, you can do this. Right. So I get all motivated again. Right? Getting the show on paper. I had met like, you know, binders full of, you know, in my, in my repertoire of what I was creating a show that seemed like a show in my head.

2 (8m 31s):
Was it good? I don't know what it work. I don't know. Well, a guy comes up to me that worked in radio shack at the mall, remember radio shack. And, and he says, you know, your magic stuff is great. You would come hang out during his lunch hour, I'd show him card tricks and things like that. And we were kind of friends and he says, Hey, why don't you do a show at my college? I know the girl that books do. And I said, really? And he says, yeah. He says, Oh, he says, I can get you a meeting with her. And I said, okay, tell her I'm a hypnotist. Right? She says, you're a hypnotist.

2 (9m 12s):
Yeah, I'm a hypnotist. Right. Cause in my mind I had it all on paper. So it gets me a meeting with this girl. And there were a few more of the students and, you know, higher entertainment to come in for the shows. And I think to myself, you know, I don't want them to ask where have you done shows before? Cause I haven't. Right. So I think to myself, if I get in front of them with a deck of cards really blow their minds. Maybe they won't even care. Right. We get in the meeting. I'm like, Hey Mike, how you doing? Nice to meet you. Hey, you want to see something crazy? They're like, yeah. So I show them some crazy. I don't even remember what it was. And, and they, I, I blow their minds with something and she just says, how much is the show?

2 (9m 59s):
Right. And at the time I threw an astronomical amount of money, which is by today's standards, nothing. I just said $700. And they said, okay, right. And so now I remember that day because it was my birthday, September 29th, the show was January. And so now I've got a few months to put a show together. Right. And I think, is this good? Is this, I had nobody to talk to. I didn't know, one hypnotist in the world, aside from him, uncle that was, you know, my great uncle at the time was probably 85. I never talked to him about it.

2 (10m 40s):
So I just go into practice mode in my bedroom door closed using a hairbrush as a microphone, going over this show over and over and over meaning there's an audience pretending they're applauding. Right. They're cheering. They're laughing at what they're seeing on stage. So I just went over it over and over. And so morning of the Tums in January, I'm sick as a dog. Right. But I'm not sick with sick. I'm sick with fear, right? Like what are you crying crazy? You're about to try this. So, so I remember being in the shower, just sick.

2 (11m 21s):
It was a noontime show. Right? So in the morning I'm just in the shower, sick. And I think I have to call Jill, the girl who booked me and cancel this show. Right. But then that voice came in my head again, this could change your life. Right? So I'm going to do it. Only one other person knew I was doing the show and it was my friend who was going to run the sound for me, you know, play cassette tapes at the time. This is how long ago this was. Right. He's going to play cassettes with music, for the show, things like that. He picks me up. We go to the college. I didn't say a word, just, just frozen in fear.

2 (12m 1s):
And so, and he knew it. So we get there and some people are coming into the room and I know enough in my mind, I need to get into state. Right. Because I was just sweating. Right. So what do I know? I know how to do card tricks. So as people are coming in, I'm going to show them card tricks. I'm going to get them excited for the show. Right? That went well. Well, they introduce me. I come out and I knew I had to act like I've done this a thousand times before. So long story short, 240 people are there. I get a standing ovation up until that day.

2 (12m 43s):
I'd never hypnotized a person in my life. Crazy. Right. The nerve, the nerve that I had. Right. But this is the reason I'd love to share this story is because when you want something, when you've got a goal, go for it, break the rules. If you, if you have to do it, I wasn't a hypnotist, but I thought I was in here. So guess what? That made me a hypnotist. If I was congruent, if I was going through the motions, cause believe me, when I, you know, I was starting with, first of all, my big fear was people aren't going to volunteer for this.

2 (13m 27s):
Right. I asked her volunteers, they come running up. I'm like, Oh, look at this. I got like 30 people up here. Right. And first thing I did was a hand class test. Right. And so I'm like, Oh please, please, please let this work. But I'm acting like I've done it a million times. We had posters and made, you know, so they were all over the campus because as you know, with suggestion, with hypnosis rapport and prestige is part of it. Right? So in their minds, this campus would never hire someone that wasn't a hypnotist, but they did. Right. But they believed that I was a hypnotist. Therefore I was right.

2 (14m 8s):
If something assumes, transmit, causes trans. So we're getting to the suggestibility tests, panned class test, and I'm thinking, Oh please, please, please, please. And so, you know, I'm giving the suggestions, the more you try it, your hands are getting tighter and tighter and tighter. So I don't, I'm like go and try the harder you try the tighter, they continue to lock. People can open their hands. The audience is like, Oh my gosh. I'm like, Oh my gosh, it's working. Right crazy. And so then I'm getting to the induction and people are going onto the floor right later on. I'm turning this girl into Madonna. That's how, that's how the shows dated. Right? And girls sing like Madonna, all this stuff.

2 (14m 50s):
The guy who was running my sound, who knew me, were just looking at each other once in a while, like what's happening, it's working right. And shows over the girl who booked me. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I'm going to recommend you at another campus, which this was Sheridan college in Brampton, Ontario, Canada recommended me at one in Toronto Seneca. Then Jill from Sheridan brought me back and back and forth. And that's how things started. And the funny thing was this probably about eight years ago, this girl, Jill who booked for my first show finds me on Facebook. And she says, are you, you're the Michael C. Anthony that did a show at Brampton campus back in the nineties.

2 (15m 37s):
Hey Jill, how are you doing? Right. Great to see you. And so we're friends on, on, on Facebook for several years. It wasn't until about a year ago. I said, Jill, I have to tell you something. I have to come clean. The show you book me for. I had never hypnotized a person in my life until that day. Right. Thank you for believing in me, you've launched an amazing career. Right? And he was like, Oh, I would have never known you're welcome. And you know, it was awesome. I have great memories of them, of the show. So that was a leap of faith, if you will. Right. And here's what I learned from it. Another thing I learned from it, I will never be that nervous for something again in my life.

2 (16m 23s):
Right. So anything that has come my way, there's been many challenges like anybody has, you know, can you do this? This is going to be difficult. You know, I've had to go up and give keynote speeches. I'm also a body language expert. And I, I train corporations. I train executives how to motivate, sell, and persuade using body language and you know, several things that I've had to do, which were kind of nerve wracking. But I just say to myself, this is nothing compared to what you had to do in, in the nineties with that hypnosis show. So suck it up, son, you can do it. So, so that's, that's what works for me.

2 (17m 5s):
It's kind of jumping in that way will appear as they say, right? So that's, that's how I roll with things. It's like just run through it. But of course be prepared. I was as prepared as you can imagine. And that's what I tell my students with stage hypnosis university, even though I share my story with them and some of my students go in cold, just like I did. Some of them learn on, on a group of friends, things like that. And that's fine, but be prepared if you believe you're a hypnotist, you are hypnotist, right. If you've got the skills to, you know, if you've, if you've practiced, if you've, if you, you know, are completely congruent with what you're doing, then they'll believe your hypnotist.

2 (17m 55s):
Therefore you are.

1 (17m 57s):
I love that. So am I correct? In understanding you didn't have any formal hypnosis training up before that first show?

2 (18m 4s):
Ooh, I have. Since of course, Mike Mandela and I trained together did our NLP stuff. He was one above. He was doing the, I was doing the practitioner and he was doing his master prac at the time. And we trained in Ericksonian hypnosis. And of course I've done other training since then on the therapeutic side. But up until that day, nothing,

1 (18m 25s):
That is incredible. I tell people, we, you know, we learn everything we know by modeling people. We learn how to walk by modeling people that walk, we learn how to speak by modeling people who speak. And so hearing that story and hearing the phenomenal success you had in that first show, where all you were doing is modeling the people that you had studied before then with no formal training. And I think of people who have done multiple, multiple have multiple certifications and they're still not ready to call themselves a hypnotist. And so I just, I love that you stepped into that identity before you felt ready before you abs you know, even knew that you could do it.

1 (19m 6s):
And when you told the story about standing in front of your mirror and rehearsing with the hairbrush and imagining the applause, I think when we're vividly imagining success like that, it's almost like it's telling our unconscious, this is what I want to have happen. And then when you show up on stage, you are more congruent,

2 (19m 23s):
Right? It manifests itself because really unconsciously that wasn't my first time on stage. It was my hundredth time on stage because it was in here already. Right. It was my mind a bit racy maybe, but I pulled it off. And, and I've used that as a life lesson for any other thing that has come up in my life. I'm like, Oh, I don't feel too comfortable doing that, make it happen.

1 (19m 57s):
And now that you've told this story, people who are listening or watching can use that as well.

2 (20m 2s):
Right? Absolutely.

1 (20m 4s):
When you think about the time you said you've kind of stepped away from it for how long, when, you know you planned for a couple of years and were, and then you just set it aside.

2 (20m 14s):
Exactly. It was about a year and a half to two and a half years, somewhere in that, in that year period,

1 (20m 21s):
You remember some of the things that were going through your head when you made that decision,

2 (20m 25s):
The self-talk that was going through my mind was who do you think you are? Right. You're new. You can't be an entertainer. You're not a hypnotist. How are you going to start an entire career? You want to make this your living. You want to join the circus, you know, and you're not going to be successful with this. It was just continual negativity for myself. And then I don't know what it was. Maybe I had a bad day at the cookie store because we were running the cookie store in Canada, hit a recession. So it wasn't good financially for a while.

2 (21m 5s):
Right. And I was making money, doing my magic stuff on weekends at restaurants. Like they would hire me to go table the table, that kind of thing. And I was making good, decent money doing that, but I was having to give it all to the cookie store. Right? So I'm like, well, what kind of life is this? Good is feeding bad. And I'm breaking. Even I got to do something else, but then all of a sudden you can do this. It just flooded in. I still didn't have an answer. Right? Like I said, jumping a net will appear. But fortunately, that guy came to me and said, Hey, I know the person that books the show, but I'll tell you the way life works.

2 (21m 51s):
Even though a guy came up to me and said, and it seems like, Oh, that was the big break because of where my mindset was. And anybody's mindset can be, if they're, if they're really focused on a goal, if they're fearful, they can, they can over override that. And I truly believe that the opportunity would have come somewhere else if it wasn't from him, because when you're looking for opportunity, you're gonna, you're gonna find it. Or, or if you're just you you've, you've learned some skills you're motivated. You're excited. You're going to see opportunity in places where you wouldn't otherwise even be looking.

1 (22m 31s):
Absolutely. So after that first show, all your shows after that were phenomenal successes, every, every hypnotic protocol worked really well. Or did you experience some, some challenges?

2 (22m 45s):
Of course, like anything like anything was every show at 10 out of 10? No, but most were great. And this is what I tell my students. I say, look, you might go out there and do a show that in your mind, because you've seen the 10 out of 10, right? Like my, my, my student has had a great show, beautiful theater, all this stuff. And then you suddenly get plunked out for the show that wasn't promoted. Well, and there were like 20 people there. And it wasn't a great show, right? Even if you do a show, that's a six out of 10, tell yourself they don't know what your 10 at a 10 is.

2 (23m 25s):
As long as they're having a great time, you're creating hypnotic phenomenon. People are having fun audience supply, even though it's only 20, I would consider that a show that small 20 people, more of a demonstration as opposed to a show. So it has a different vibe to it. But as long as the people that hired, you are happy with it, then you're golden. I've never had a show where I couldn't hypnotize anybody. Now, the, the makings of stage hypnosis, you start off with twice as many people as you're going to do the base of the show with me, do your suggestibility tests. So you're basically setting the stage for yourself for great volunteers. You know, I, I liken it.

2 (24m 7s):
I, when I'm, when I'm comparing stage hypnosis to hypnotherapy with hypnosis, with stage hypnosis, you've got a great induction. It's not script gnosis, but it's more, you're calibrating and you're moving the way you need to move. But you know, the essence of what you're going to do is going to work because it's worked a million times now with hypnotherapy, if protocol number one's not working, you got to shift a protocol. Number two, because you're only dealing with one person. Right, right. You got to shift protocol number three, and then you might be running out of protocols. Right? So that, that's a distinction. That's a difference between the two there.

2 (24m 47s):
But the good thing about it, when a therapy, where I say hypnotherapy is easier. If you're only dealing with one person, usually, unless you're doing a group thing like Freddie Jacqueline would do. But if you are, you're only dealing with one person for the most part. And so you're only calibrating one person stage hypnosis. Not only you're calibrating 30, but there's a love triangle happening on stage. There's you? There's a, there's the volunteers and there's the audience. So you're, you're doing what you're doing here. You're connecting with the audiences back and forth. Which volunteers do I like? Which ones might I be sending back? So at first there's a lot going on in your head, but like anything, it gets easy over time. Right?

1 (25m 28s):
I would imagine it's a bit of a rush as well, but if it can be really enjoyable.

2 (25m 32s):
Oh yeah. It's a, it's a, it's a fun job. You know, people say, Oh, you have a really fun job. I'm like, well, the job is fun, but I'll tell you it's not fun. Getting up at 4:00 AM to go to the airport, jumping on planes, waiting hotels, life on the road. That's not that fun. But overall, I wouldn't, I wouldn't choose another way. I love it. Been a fun ride.

1 (25m 55s):
I love it. Well, and we're recording this on August 10th in the middle of the whole COVID fiasco. How has that impacted your career? And

2 (26m 6s):
A lot live shows. None. You know, I've had to cancel, I can't tell you how many, a ton, but I'm doing live streams as I also do mentalism stuff. So I'm doing, mentalism live streams for a lot of shows. And, but I do a lot of training online, so that's continuing to go, you know, so it's fine. It's fine enough. You know, I love to go on stage. Yeah. It's fun. But you know, there's no panic mode happening here because my, the training side of my business is going well, I'm going to have to look into

1 (26m 44s):
That. I was actually going to train with you in Vegas, in the next, maybe even right now. It's either now or in the next couple of days. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm going to have to look into your trainings just real quick. This seems like a perfect place to plug this in people who are listening and would like to train with you, where can they go?

2 (27m 2s):
Okay. Two trainings, the flagship program, the big one that includes one-on-one mentorship with me and, and massive video library, stage hypnosis, university.com. And then there's a smaller, more beginning. Stick your toe in the water. Learn amazing things. All video [email protected]

1 (27m 23s):
Okay, perfect. Michael, you were mentioning before we started rolling that you have had, you have some other examples of times when you've overcome fear, would you share one of those with us?

2 (27m 36s):
Yeah, I've got a lot of them, but I know the one you're referring to, it was 11, 10 97, 2007. I had gone to the doctor gotten random blood work random Tuesday afternoon were things just going Tuesday afternoon. Right. And call from the doctor. And they said, they said, you've got kidney disease. And I said, Oh, my creatinine was high. Who knows what creatinine is? Unless you're in the kidneys. Right. And I'm like, Oh wow. How do I lower that? Do I need to go vegan?

2 (28m 16s):
What do I need to do? Right. And he said, you're going to need a kidney transplant. And I'm like, Oh man. So, and it's from where you are right now. Your kidneys are functioning at 32%. And we do kidney transplant. It's at 10%. And it will take you about four years to get there. Right. So, okay. Life throws a blow, right? We all, we all get blows one extreme or another. And so now I'm going into research mode. Is there really a way around this? Is there something else I can do? Right.

2 (28m 56s):
And so I find out that in India, in India, they are doing amazing work with kidney transplants where you get what's called kidney tolerance, which means you don't need medication. Right. And your kid, there's no chance of rejection. So I'm looking at that and I'm making phone calls to India looking into it. What would the details be? But then my dad sends me an email. He says, this looks like the thing you're looking at in India, in Chicago. Right. So I call Chicago and they're doing a research program on, on kidney tolerance.

2 (29m 39s):
So I'm like, well, let me contact them. My brother, God bless him. Stepped up right away, said, I'll give you a kidney. Wow. And so that was, that was bonus. And so we both go to Chicago, they do a bunch of tests, the amount of blood they took out of us test tubes. I don't know how many it was frightening. And they said, we'll accept you for the research program. And I'm like, okay. So split still, a lot of me is nervous research program. It sounded like, sounded like a Guinea pig. Right. And so, so, you know, years have passed.

2 (30m 20s):
So we're getting closer to that four year point where it's where my failure rate is down to close to 10%. And so we're doing all the tests and I get accepted to the program. And so what it is is they are, they need to remove my immune system and give me my brother's immune system. And I said, okay, how do you do that? Well, it's a high dose chemotherapy and total body radiation, which I wasn't excited about. Right. Who would be, but I looked at it as short-term pain for long-term gain. Right. Alright.

2 (30m 60s):
So we're getting close to transplant day. My brother is just, they put him in this room with an IV in his arm and he's watching movies. Well, they're taking a while. They're taking his immune system out and it regenerates itself right now. They're taking it out. It goes into this big machine with more dials and numbers. And I can say this ticket. So, but, and so then I have to start my chemo and radiation and they get my immune system down to absolute zero, actually less than zero. I don't know how that's possible, but the doctor says it's less than zero. He sit. And this is the day before transplant.

2 (31m 41s):
Now he said two days before transplant, everyone had to wear masks. Just like now I was born in the plastic bubble. You said, don't shave. If you cut yourself, we can't stop. The bleeding you'll die. Right. You don't have an immune system. Don't bump into anything. You'll get a bruise which will cover your entire body and you'll die. Right. Your body has no ability to heal right now. So just lay there. I know, okay. That's what I need to do for two days, I couldn't get a German mean nothing. Right? And so it comes to transplant day. They give me my brother's kidney, but now I have no immune system.

2 (32m 23s):
Right? The next day they come in with this massive machine, put an IV into me and they're giving me my brother's immune system. So now my body doesn't because as you may know, most people who get an organ transplant have to be on hi high dose immunotherapy medications. They need to make the immune system not as smart as it should be. So it doesn't recognize this foreign object in there. But along with that, you can be more prone to other diseases. So they start to put this immune system in me and my life starts coming back. Right? I'm starting to feel normal.

2 (33m 5s):
Within two days, I feel normal. My blood pressure, which it's a symptom of kidney disease. My blood pressure, let me get this straight was 240 over one 60, right? They before transplant, when they, when they took it, the nurses freaked out called the doctors running up and the what's wrong. What's wrong. He look at his blood pressure. He's going to have a heart attack. He has kidney disease. He's getting a transplant tomorrow. Let's hope he makes it that far. Right? Brutal. So they get this inmate. My blood pressure goes right down to normal and I am the 15th person in the world.

2 (33m 48s):
Fortunately, with a transplanted organ. I need no immunosuppressives at all. I don't even have to take an aspirin. Yeah. I'm just a guy with one kidney. But again, lesson learned with that for me personally was sometimes you have to take a risk. Right? I was scared. Of course I could die. Right. But I'm like, I'm going to take this risk. And even somebody who had to get a transplant, an organ without doing it the way I did, you know, thank God for the medications. Right? But sometimes you just have to gamble. If you want to get from point a to point B might not be fun, but you come out on the other side, when it's successful, you come out a, a more powerful person.

2 (34m 39s):
Somebody who is overcoming adversity in one way or another, and then not only is that help you in your life, but you can help other people with, with their issues that they're facing, because you've experienced fear, trauma, whatever it is in your own way, but that, that can help others as well.

1 (35m 0s):
So you get your diagnosis and then there's four years between the diagnosis and the surgery. Can you talk to me a little bit about that journey? The, you know, the, self-talk the mindset that you went through during that four years, and once it was time to have that surgery, what that was like, just so that others will have an ability to model that.

2 (35m 21s):
Yup. Scared, nervous, worried. Because my answer was four years away. It's a long time. And of course during that time, the Chicago thing didn't come up right away for the first three years, I thought I was doing a traditional transplant. I was regularly going into the hospital called Lifelink here in Tampa. And I was scheduled right. Found out about this other thing. And you know, so it was back and forth to Chicago, Tampa didn't know. And I was scheduled for surgery in Tampa and I called them weeks before and said, I'm not doing it.

2 (36m 3s):
I'm doing another thing. And I told the doctor what this was. He had never heard of it because it's research top end stuff. And he says, I've never heard of that. Are you crazy? You're being a Guinea pig. I'm like, you know, choice. She makes some people wouldn't do it. There's no wrong choice, but this is what I wanted to do and worked out great. Here I am. I did it December 1st, 2011. So nine, almost nine years ago.

1 (36m 34s):
I really appreciate you sharing that. I know will resonate with someone. It's, it's a scary process. You know, when, when someone gives you a diagnosis, there's a lot of fear that comes along with that. And so I love that it's turned you into a more triumphant, resilient person, right?

2 (36m 51s):
And sometimes, sometimes an overcoming fear only, you know, Apple has to think different, right? You just have to change your mindset and go in another direction. I laugh at that because I just saw it the other day. You watch Seinfeld at all.

1 (37m 12s):
I have only seen a few episodes anyway,

2 (37m 14s):
So, but viewers will know this Joris Cassandra. Who's kind of funny. He, he comes and sits down in the cafe one day where George and Elaine are. And he says, my life is a mess. Every decision I've ever made is wrong. Right. And the waitress comes up and knows what he's going to order. So she says, tuna on toast with a coffee. Right. And he says, yes, she walks away. And he says, no, come back. If every decision I make is the wrong one, then the opposite must be right. Right. Give me chicken on bread, on toasted and a cup of tea.

2 (37m 55s):
Right? So, but the whole episode was how George was doing everything different than he used to do. And he was getting a different result, you know, in, in the sitcom, he was meeting a girl and everything was starting to work for him. Right. And I say that not, you know, to the, to the viewers, not opposite on everything, but less than a learned in that when you make a decision, you wouldn't normally make, you know, we have to make those very consciously. Those don't come automatic. But when you make a decision, you wouldn't normally make, get ready for different results. Right. And those results might just come right where you want it can work.

2 (38m 37s):
Maybe not always that, you know, I've messed up many times. I've made many wrong decisions in my life. We all do. But when we are, when we're not afraid to think different, we're not afraid to act. If we're not afraid to face fear, then anything can happen. We can get great results.

1 (38m 59s):
I love that you teach people. You have, do you have a course specifically for stage fright or is it a component of your other training course. Yeah. Okay. So do you, is there anything particular that you teach in that course that you'd like to speak to in that

2 (39m 16s):
Kind of what I've been alluding to here is to when you are faced with something, move through it, there's an old country song. I remember when it says, when you're going through hell, keep on moving, right? Because you're going to walk through it. And also this was a big thing for me, as far as stage fright is concerned. And you alluded to it earlier, model others. Right? When I did my first show, I didn't know Mike Minda, we've been best friends now since Foley in 1996.

2 (39m 55s):
And, and, but when I was up there at first, I was modeling Mike Mendell because in my mind he was the best. Right. And he is. And, but it's funny. I joke with Mike, because I say you are so good at what you do. Cause you know, Mike performed for many, many years on stage and you were so good at what you do, but that scared me. It was actually me seeing another hypnotist that made me go, I think I can do as good as him. Right. And so I joke with Mike, I say, I say, you didn't, you didn't get me into this. This other guy really is what made me jump, jump through the hoops.

2 (40m 35s):
Right? So it doesn't matter when we, when we take that chance, when we take that risk, we might not come out 10 out of 10. We might come out nine. We might come out eight. We might come up seven, but we're going to come out different than we were in likely much better than we were. Yes. And then with practice, with repetition, with the confidence that we build through taking that risk through facing that fear, then facing fear. It gets easier.

1 (41m 12s):
I love that. I, when I look back at who I was, when I quit my job as a hairstylist and decided to take that leap, even though it was so scary for me just to tell, introduce myself as a hypnotist, it was so scary because it didn't feel true. But I said it anyway. And I look at all the things that I've been through all the times I've had to do it afraid all the times that I've had to model someone because I think I could do it myself. It has changed who I am as a person. It's not just a set, a skill set that I've acquired. It's who I've become. And it's been, I think about a hundred times harder than I thought it was going to be an about a thousand times more gratifying.

2 (41m 50s):
Right? Oh, absolutely. But now when someone asks you, what you do, you say it with full confidence, full congruence. They might think you're weird, but everyone, you know, anytime you say him, it's just people like, they look at you funny, all that stuff, but you know, you're a hypnotist now. Yes. Right. And, and this goes with any aspect of life, whether it be your job, whether it be wanting to like you quit your job. As a hairstylist, I wanted to get out of the cookie store. I wanted to do something to someone's thinking of making that leap. Fear is normal. Don't wait until you're not afraid that day's not coming. Okay.

2 (42m 30s):
Learn how to handle fear. There's still going to be fear in the background. But when you, when you jumped through, when you get to the other side, you'll be like, wow, that was hard, but it was worth it. And like you said, way more gratifying.

1 (42m 44s):
Absolutely. Michael, will you talk to me about so many times, I just heard this the other day, how, you know, stage hypnotists make people cluck like chickens and bark, like dogs and it makes it harder for the people that are doing work therapeutically. And when I first started, I kind of felt that way as well. And then I spoke with the stage hypnotist, who said, I think every clinical hypnotherapists should know how to do stage work because it really enhances that. So can you speak to that thought process?

2 (43m 15s):
Well, my talk at hypno thoughts live and I recorded a virtual version as well with stage hypnosis for hypnotherapists. Right. And here's the thing. When a hypnotherapist goes on stage and realizes that they have the ability in and out, they might need to learn some stage presence and things like that. But when they go out there and hypnotize a whole group of people and have fun, they're a better person for it. Just like me.

2 (43m 55s):
For example, if I have to hypnotize one person, that's a little more foreign for me, I can do it. But I really gotta be like, okay, where am I going with this? What am I going to do? What am I going to say? Cause I don't do it a lot. Right? Because my, my, my profession is groups of people. But when you get out, when you get out there, you become a much more rounded hypnotist. And many of the hypnotherapists that, that I mentor and train, the reason they want to do it is not because they don't like what they do. Hypnotherapists do amazing work. And I commend them for it, but they want to go and actually have fun with hypnosis.

2 (44m 36s):
It's like using it at a whole other way. Right. And make great money on the side or just do demonstrations. But here, here's why I think they should learn it because it will scale your hypnotherapy business faster than you ever thought possible. Here's why you are performing on stage doing a great demonstration or a great show. There's an audience watching, whether it be 50 or 500 and they're watching, let's pretend you're on stage. And they're saying, Whoa, look at that, Lori, she's really a good hypnotist. She's really entertaining. And she seems really nice. So you've got a rapport.

2 (45m 16s):
Okay. And during her talk bef before she got the volunteers, pre-talk the lecture, whatever you're gonna call it, you're talking about hypnosis, but you're also saying it I'm a hypnotherapist. I help people with their phobias, with their fears, with their weight, whatever it may be. So now you've got 500 people watching thinking what a great hypnotist she is. I wonder if she can help me with my weight wander. She can help me with my anxiety, wonder she can help me with my phobia. So where are you going to be at the end of the show? At the end of the show, you're going to be at the back of the room at a table with business cards, maybe merchandise, whatever it is, meeting people, signing things, whatever it is. And I remember one of my students from Norway, Thomas is his name.

2 (46m 1s):
He did his first show. He's a hypnotherapist. He did his first show. And that first show and his first show was small. And he goes, Michael, and you can't believe it. I got several new clients just from that small show. Right? So it can really scale your business fast. If that's something you want to do, maybe your, maybe your business is as busy as you want it to be, but maybe you want to go out and have fun with hypnosis. Use it in a whole other way. Some of my students are hypnotherapists, but they've got that artistic bug in them. And they want to get out and be creative and you know, beyond the stage. So that's why they do it.

2 (46m 42s):
So everyone's got different reasons for wanting to do things, but options are, they're amazing.

1 (46m 48s):
So today, knowing everything that you know, having had all of these experiences, having the wisdom that you have today, if you were to go back and tell that 26 years ago, Michael, who was getting ready just to put it all aside and start a cookie company. If you were to give him some kind of advice or words of wisdom, what would you say to him?

2 (47m 9s):
I would say, don't sweat it. So you can do anything you put your mind to. And if you want to be a hypnotist, you can be a hypnotist. If you want it to be a businessman, if you want it to be a doctor, if you want to be a lawyer, providing the resource to get yourself there, that's what you can do. I'm a, I don't know if you studied the Enneagram at all. I'm a seven and fun is who I am right now. The Enneagram seven is the fun person to get adventurer. The person who doesn't like to do the same thing every day. Right? So that's why this really appealed to me.

2 (47m 51s):
You know, Hey, you don't have to do that nine to five. If you don't want to, maybe you'll be doing, you know, I've performed in Australia. I've performed in Hawaii, every state except Alaska. Why Alaska can't you hire me, the UK ever. And I've also had the benefit of training around the world. So when I started doing stage hypnosis, did I ever think I was going to be a trainer? Nope. Right. But doors open along the way. And anybody out there, no matter what it is, you want to do understand that when you land on your feet, other things are going to start to happen for you that you didn't expect.

2 (48m 34s):
I'm sure you can say that when you decided you want to be a hypnotist, you're probably doing things. I see. I S I see that you're doing trainings with people and things like that. Probably because when you're a beginner, you're kind of like, Oh boy, Oh, if I can just do this one thing, but when you, when you start to get good at what you do, other doors open. Yes.

1 (48m 58s):
I've definitely learned that. I never expected to have the audience that I have and be making the impact that I'm making. It's. I think one thing for me, when I started to make myself more public people thought of me, it did build that rapport. And it built a sense of prestige where people saw me as an expert in my field, even though I was new. So many people would come to me and say, I want to start. But, and it's just all these imposter syndrome things, these voices that are going through their head, the same things that you've, that you've heard and moved beyond. And I realized there's such a desire for this. And, and once Covid, you know, once locked down happened, and people can't go out and do life as usual, there's such a need for this, for this content and this material.

1 (49m 45s):
So I think being open, just starting to take action and move forward, even if you're not sure what you're doing, or if you're doing it right, it's making a decision and then making the decision, right? Yeah.

2 (49m 55s):
I tell people during, I totally agree. I tell people during this time, look, don't take Covid as you can't do anything, gotta sit around. And like, this is the time to sharpen your sword. This is the time when, when think, when things get back to normal, have a be great at what you do, you know, come out with a new skill of some kind or what existing skill you have, make sure that short is really sharp. You know? So it, doesn't what you do have your marketing in place. Get ready to go. So when those doors open, you know, you are, you're running full steam.

2 (50m 36s):
Yes.

1 (50m 36s):
Speaking of marketing, what would you say to the person who, you know, they've invested all this time into learning hypnosis, and they realize that if you build it, they will come doesn't work. And they realizing they need to focus more on marketing, but they're resistant to that idea. What would you say to that person?

2 (50m 53s):
All the people that I know that really Excel at, what they do, they're not always the best at what they do, but they're the best marketers, your marketing game, no matter what business you're in has to be on point, whether it be a hypnotherapist, a stage hypnotist or any profession, the ones that rise to the top are the ones that are the best marketers, right? Because they're out there, they're in your face or on social media. They're making videos and marketing. Marketing is key. I know somebody who struggles.

2 (51m 37s):
And I was talking to him a while ago, he's he's in the video business. And I said, look, if you really want to get out there, if you need more gigs, they need to know you're there. You know? Cause what is marketing really? When you look at marketing, all marketing is really saying is available to be hired. Pick me, pick me. I'm here for you. Right? And if your message with them connects and they're like, Oh, I really look at this Laurie girl. I saw her video. Oh, she's available to help me with anxiety. She's available to help me with weight loss. She seems really nice. I'm going to call her. I'm going to email her. Now, if, if you didn't have that Mark, and if you didn't have the video, they don't know who you are.

2 (52m 20s):
So how far are you going to take it? Not very, absolutely.

1 (52m 24s):
I, I came to a decision a couple of years ago that I was going to have to devote at equal time to understanding marketing as being a good hypnotist. And what I found is the two coincide so beautifully. I think that so much of the, you know, we're influencing people as marketer, as marketers, we're influencing people as hypnotists. And when you're doing it from a place of genuine care and genuinely wanting to help people. And I think for me, when I stepped into the, the idea that it's okay for me to talk about myself, it's okay to tell people, you really should do this. This is an opera awesome opportunity. It helped me realize that I'm actually doing them a service by putting myself out there and by making myself public,

2 (53m 8s):
You are, and it doesn't feel like marketing, right? It's not like the old days where, you know, we have to put ads in magazines and sending postcards and things like that. Right? So today's marketing is a little different. It's very people driven. It's very, you know, sometimes you see people who seem to be making videos every day and you're like, Oh, this person again, will it tell you? They're the ones that are going to hit the person who needs them and they're going to get the business. Right. So it's, it's like, it's like a duck. We seem very calm on the surface, but underneath the water, we're all doing this.

2 (53m 52s):
Right.

1 (53m 54s):
And you can have a blast doing it. It's all perspective and mindset. What if it's a game, right? Absolutely. Do you have any, any resources within your program for marketing or is there any place you would

2 (54m 6s):
Got a whole marketing section in my program? How to get out there and market, whether it be videos, whether it be posters, whether it be postcard, marketing, email, marketing, all that kind of stuff. Because I, I tell my students all the time, you can have the greatest stage hypnosis show in the world, but if you don't know how to sell it, you got nothing. And that goes with any business right now, one of the beauties of stage hypnosis, you can have an agent agents doing a lot of that work for you. I have several agents that work for me. So there is a plus to have worked hard enough or other people are doing that.

2 (54m 48s):
But at the same time you're paying them commission. Right? So, but, but so self-represented agent, there's pluses and minuses to everything. But at this point in my life, I like to have someone else doing that. So I can really focus on what I do and what I do. I'm a stage hypnotist. Yes. But I've got a studio in my house where I'm making videos. I'm heading to my program. I work directly with my Facebook marketer guy. I'm focusing on that aspect of the business. Even though I'm a stage hypnotist, the marketing, I was talking for an hour today with my Facebook marketer saying, okay, what about this?

2 (55m 29s):
Let's do this. Let's try this. You know, trying to figure things out. So here I am, I don't have a degree in marketing, but I'm figuring it out.

1 (55m 38s):
Awesome. And that's part of the adventure. I think something about having that beginner's mind and knowing there's always more to learn is, is actually very gratifying. When you think about that person who is getting ready to shelf their training and getting ready to stay inside their comfort zone. Is there anything else that's on your heart to say to that person, to help them understand that now is the time to take action?

2 (56m 2s):
Well, I'll tell you my story stage hypnosis university started the old fashioned way. Many years ago. If somebody bought the program, a box arrived at their door, manuals, CDs, DVDs, right? And I had that going. And then after my kidney transplant, I took a bit of a pause it. And then I talked to Mike Mandale every day, pretty much. And he started working with Chris and getting, getting like Mandela gnosis Academy going. And he knew I had the analog version of stage hypnosis university. And he knew I was building a studio in my house to do the digital version.

2 (56m 45s):
Right. It took me two and a half years to make it, I could have done it in six months. Right. Lots of videos, but maybe I could have done it in a year, maybe two and a half. It took. And it was, Mike was saying to me, you've got to get your university going. You've got to get your university going so much work, but you do it. It's marketing. Right. But every people who are working on, whether it be digital materials, here's what we have in 2020 that we've never had before we can do one piece of work. One great video can have a shelf life of years, right?

2 (57m 27s):
We never, we we've never lived in a place like this in a time like this. We've never lived in a time. I sell my program. Not only in America, I sell it around the world. Right. We never lived in a time like that. 25 years ago, if you wanted to sell anything, you'd open a store, right? Like my cookie store. But now we live in a time where we can in our own house where you are right there with that camera in front of you, you can make videos. You can great give great value, great content and launch it around the world. Some stuff might be free tripwire type stuff to get them to you. Some stuff you're charging money for.

2 (58m 10s):
I saw you were doing something with Freddie. Jack went a while ago, partnering up with other people. As you know, the hypnosis community is full of people that will help you. Yes. Right? We're very open community. Unlike some other businesses that hold the cards tighter to their chest. But there's great people in great areas that are willing to, you know, sometimes I'll go to Chris Thompson and I've got a business question. Sometimes he'll come to me. When he wants me to look at his website because he likes my design, a decent eye for design. And so he'll look at me. He says, look at this page, tell me what you think, what would you move around?

2 (58m 53s):
Right. And I'll contact him. Hey, well, how would you handle this? If you working on this kind of thing. So we help each other. And there is a, a lot of people that would be willing to help that person who has put it out there. And another thing I told you, it took me two and a half years to make stage at gnosis university the entire time. I didn't know if it would even work. Right. My wife would say to me in Europe, they're shooting videos all the time. I'm like, I'm trying to create something here because with my program, it wasn't just make a video, put it out there, make a video, put it out there, make a video, put it up.

2 (59m 33s):
Mine is a compilation of like over 400 videos, 30, 37 chapters, all in the order, which you build a show from your introduction to your marketing, to agents, to inductions so much stuff. The entire time I made that, I'm like this thing, even going to work, you know, I put myself out there and it did right. If they build it and they will come, as they say,

1 (1h 0m 4s):
That's amazing. That is so amazing. I, when I first started doing this, I put together an anxiety program and I did the same thing. It wasn't as involved, but I made all the videos up front and then I completed the product. And I think I put a little blip on Facebook and I didn't sell a single one. And I think it's because nobody knew who I was yet. I didn't have any kind of a following or connections in the industry. And it just, it makes such a difference when you start to be willing to put yourself out there and we'll see you. And,

2 (1h 0m 38s):
And you didn't know, maybe at the time your marketing wasn't dialed in. Right.

1 (1h 0m 43s):
I didn't know. I don't think I had any marketing yet.

2 (1h 0m 45s):
Right. But you learn as you go. And you know, I don't know if you've relaunched it or not, or redid it or whatever, but there's a lot of people who have anxiety. So, you know, there's a market for it.

1 (1h 0m 59s):
This is true. This is true. Yes, absolutely. Oh, this has been so awesome. Is there anything that I haven't asked you that you think would be valuable for us to know about you or your practice?

2 (1h 1m 12s):
Yeah. I mean, as far as what I do, people want to go to station gnosis university.com. That's the big flagship program. If people want to get their foot wet and learn great stuff, the hypnosis blueprint.com. And if anybody had a question for me, support at stage hypnosis, university.com, that's the direct way to get to me, happy to help people in any way I can, that this has been a lot of fun.

1 (1h 1m 40s):
This has been amazing. And I will put all that information in the notes below the show, wherever you're watching or listening. Michael, thank you. Sorry.

2 (1h 1m 48s):
Let me ask you a question because when you got in touch with me for this, you introduced yourself, but I already knew who you were because I see your videos. Now. I always thought to myself that girl's good on video. What was it like for you at the beginning of the videos? Do you look back at your old videos and go,

1 (1h 2m 5s):
Yes, I've deleted some of them. But when I first started doing this, I went to a program called pop-up business school. And it was some people from the UK actually came over here and promoted this thing, where you go, you start a business with zero overhead, no loans. And I was, this was the first time I introduced it myself as a hypnotist. I had just quit my job as a hairstylist. I was terrified. And I went home and I made a video and, and I thought I was being really animated and that I was being really expressive. And I had this deer in the headlights look on my face and this monotone voice. And I just, I thought, okay, this sucks. I need to get better.

1 (1h 2m 46s):
And I need to get better quick because I kind of did the leap and the net will appear sort of maneuver myself. Cause I knew unless I mama birded myself out of the nest, I wasn't going to take action. And so I started modeling. I, someone recommended an, an audio book that was put out by the great courses about neuroscience and I love neuroscience. And the narrator had such an enthusiastic voice and her voice went up and then it went back down and it was very engaging. And it was like a 20 hour book. And I listened to that thing. Every time I was in my car and I spoke along with her and my voice went up when hers went up and then it went down and lo and behold, when I started making my videos, they were better.

1 (1h 3m 29s):
And then I would watch Mike Mandela's trainings and I would speak along with him and man, that man speaks quickly.

2 (1h 3m 37s):
Yup. Yeah. I'm sure you, I'm sure. You've noticed like me, even though I've been an entertainer for a long time, when I started shooting videos, that's a different animal. Right. You know, I'm in front of the camera and I'm like, okay, so I'm Michael C at the end, this cut. Do it again. Right. So many times you don't want to hear all the B roll for that, because that was like, you start to get really frustrated with yourself. Right. And I can even look back at Mike's old stuff in the video and think they weren't as dialed in at the beginning as they are now.

1 (1h 4m 11s):
Right.

2 (1h 4m 13s):
So there, there's a great expression out there that says a good job now is better than sorry. A decent job now is better than a great job. Never. Right. So do it, get it done. It might not be perfect. My, I can look at the beginning of stage hypnosis university and think, I can tell you, you weren't practiced up enough then. Right? You could probably look at your role. So most people can. I followed a guy, Brendan Bouchard. I don't know if you know who he is. He's a, he's an internet guru kind of guy. And he talks about just do it. You're a creator.

2 (1h 4m 55s):
Get out there and create, it might not be absolutely perfect at first, get out there, make it happen. Because next thing you know, you'll be saying, remember when I had a really hard time and didn't know what to say to that camera. I was coaching a student the other day. And I was saying, because he was having a hard time saying, just pretend it's a person, don't it. And I said, go over your lines, talk in the mirror, you know, talk to the dashboard in your car, talk to a light fixture. Whenever it is over time, you just, you get out of your own head and you, and you, you start to connect with people.

0 (1h 5m 34s):
I agree. And just adding an elephant, an elephant, an element of playfulness or an elephant, a playfulness I'll sometimes stand back and I'll look at where I'm going to stand to make the video. And I'll imagine Tony Robbins doing the presentation or Mike Mandel or someone who is just really dynamic. And then I'll go and step inside their body and take on those characteristics for myself and make the video as Oprah or as Bernay Brown. And it comes across in such a different way when we're willing to be more. I just read this quote this morning. I wish I had it. I think it was something like, if you only do what you can do, you'll never become more than you are now. And this is a Kung Fu Panda quote.

0 (1h 6m 17s):
And I thought, you know, we, you have to, I don't really think it's faking it. I think it's, you know, when you model excellence in others, it unlocks those attributes that are dormant inside you.

2 (1h 6m 27s):
Yup. Because chances are that person you're modeling. They weren't always good either. They modeled somebody else. Right.

0 (1h 6m 36s):
This is so amazing. Michael, thank you so much for being here. Is there anything you want to add? Yeah. Is there anything you want to add before we say goodbye? I think we just about covered it all. Okay. Well thank you. Have an absolutely amazing day. Thank you listener for being here. And that's a wrap. I'm so grateful. You've listened all the way to the end. What is one tiny action step you'll take now based on an aha moment you got during the podcast, maybe that life changing action step is to come accept the gift I have for [email protected] Head there right now to get your powerful, hypnosis audio, the answer room that lets you make important decisions and get crystal clear about your next step forward on this path of purpose in your one.

0 (1h 7m 27s):
Great and precious life.

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